Reading the recent comments to the “Who are the true fans?” article, I believe there are some severe misunderstandings. It would take a great amount of time to answer to each comment directly, and some of them did have similar arguments, so I’m doing it here in a combined statement.
Why name myself “police”?
Some of you have criticized the term “police” because in your opinion it implies that I police everything I personally find unjust in fandom. That is a wrong impression. I picked the name maybe due to lack of a better idea, but mostly because I remembered an interview with Jensen, where he, himself, had mentioned fans policing wrong information.
TV Week: What’s the most outrageous thing you’ve read or heard about yourself?
Jensen Ackles: That I was married to some girl. The funny thing about working on a show like this is that the fans are very protective. If something is written on the internet, it’s amazing how quickly the fans will attack them and police them and say, “No, this is not correct. Don’t write this. You’re off the messageboards” or whatever. But there was quite a long thing for a while where people were arguing about the fact that I was married to some girl I’d never heard of. It was a bit bizarre. It was like an ongoing discussion for a year about whether or not I had this secret marriage to this girl I’d never met.
I see how the term “police” may threaten some of you, but it never has been and never will be the intention to police ‘regular’ fans and scold them for things I, personally, find wrong. This blog, as you can read in the About section, is meant to collect information on impostors and find ways to get rid of them, i.e. contacting the admins of sites where Stephanie Ware has posted false info.
Policing the parody/satire twitter accounts
Contrary to some of your allegations, I have never said “Don’t follow these fakes.” My statement about them before I listed their names was as neutral as it could be.
Most of them are merely making fun of him [Clif] and the people they are impersonating (in a more or less rude way). They’re sort of amusing and very obvious, so nothing to worry about. Yet worth mentioning just in case there might be any confusion (although I doubt anyone will take them seriously).
Why I, personally, find these people rude and offensive (which is my personal opinion that I’m now voicing in a calm and respectful way), I see that they ARE parodies and don’t fit the description of a hardcore impostor/stalker that really means to deceive other people.
Am I an elitist fan?
I don’t see myself as an elitist fan, but I see myself as a person with a strong sense of justice. As said before, this blog is mainly about the really severe cases of impersonation and stalking, which most of you, even my opponents, have agreed being a burden.
Furthermore I see myself as a kind of journalist. I point out grievances in our community and provide information. Up until the last entry “Who are the True Fans?” there have only been hard facts and figures in this blog (with exception of some vague information on @SexyJensenLOL and his supposed attempt to lure a girl into meeting him. I have, after that flaw has been pointed out to me, stressed more strongly that this info is based on hearsay and can only be labeled ‘Could Be’ as there is no hard proof he actually did it.)
Yes, it is true that I spend a lot of time on this blog. While that applies it also does to anyone that owns a fansite or makes fancreations of any kind. Ask the fanfic authors how much time they spend on their stories. Do they see themselves as elitist fans and littérateurs? Maybe. Maybe not. Each and everyone of us decides to put their energies and talents into various things, be it creative or scientific or something else.
However, after I received so much negative feedback for doing something each product testing site, newspaper or educational campaign does in other areas I made the mistake to add my personal opinion to the facts. And bluntly said, yes, I do feel I am a better fan than those that are perfectly fine with people committing libel and slander against their stars.
That, however, doesn’t mean that no ‘good and true fan’ is allowed to criticize Jared and Jensen or anyone involved. Criticism is okay, as long as it is expressed in a respectful and reasonable way. All of us have learned at school when analysing a book or poem we can’t just say “it’s bullshit and the author is a moron.” We have to find valid arguments and express them in an intelligent way.
Different opinions are good and important, but so is respect. And I got the strong feeling that some people that call themselves ‘fans’ show no respect whatsoever towards the people they should, by definition be admiring. If you say Clif is representing J and J poorly because he is no person with PR knowledge, and if you’re saying his playground comment was unwise and uncalled for and crossing a line, that is your opinion and fine (and I agree on the playground comment). But, and here’s a big but, name calling and insulting is at least as unwise and stupid as you’re accusing Clif or me to be.
Conclusion:
Fandompolice’s only purpose is it to expose and fight serious impostors and stalkers, not fans that don’t share my personal opinion.
I never said don’t follow the parody twitters or that they belong in the same category as the serious impostors.
I’m not an elitist fan and don’t see myself as one. I am concerned and worried and plan to do something about it.
This article and the last will, for now, remain the only ones that provide an insight into the person behind fandompolice and her personal opinion and motivations. The next one I write will be purely facts again.
P.S.: Oh, and thanks for the Hitler Youth comparison. Funny, since I’m German. And yes I have read “The Wave” in 9th grade.
fandompolice
rhiannon1307
onenonlyheather
9th grade? How old are you right now? Being german doesn’t mean anything, hon. Naive and ignorant people are everywhere. Sometimes people just don’t want to see it.
Alright. You might not want to be an elitist fan, but you are definitely coming off as such. I can understand what you mean and that Clif has no negative agenda and that you just want to help and bla, but the way you show yourself is ridiculous. Calling yourself Police is one thing, because Police ~from politeia (gr.) meaning state, administration, government, it makes you an official person and it needs more than just your will to be one for thousands of fans. AND you gotta be noncommited. So if you are a “journalist”, then this is the wrong place for you to be. You didn’t say you are an official person? You didn’t say that you are commited in any way? Well, you don’t come off so. Try harder.
And bluntly said, yes, I do feel I am a better fan than those that are perfectly fine with people committing libel and slander against their stars.
Well, I think most of us “critics” are actually realists. I don’t like the heavy name-calling either, but let’s state the fact: haters will never go away. If you ban them, they’re gone for a short period of time, but they’ll return nonetheless, you cannot brainwash them into liking the actresses/actors and they will not only hate them, they will hate YOU even more. That said, many of us just don’t care what those people do. We don’t like it, but we can’t do anything and we are actually aware of that, it’s each to our own choice to be actively helping or just to ignore it. And you should totally remove that part, because stating your personal opinion here is not the wisest of choices.
It’s not like I don’t appreciate what you do, but seriously, you are just presenting yourself in a bad light. You seem to be quite well-spoken, why don’t you just try a better strategy, like, you know, not writing controverse essays, that might offend other people. Or trying to understand why people are criticizing you and then finding a solution that’s acceptable for both parties? You might be thinking that I’m a massive klugscheißer right now, but I didn’t put myself into the position you are right now. Usually governments are to help the citizens, but there also critics and the government has to accept all kinds of criticism and make something better out of it.
I don’t have very much time right now, so I can’t reply to you in great detail, but I can honestly say that I do appreciate your kind of criticism. While I don’t agree with you on everything you have said you have some valid points that I will consider. Like I did before with the SexyJensenLOL article.
Just one thing: Changing the name of the blog and twitter user now doesn’t feel right to me. So all I can and will do is clear up that this “police” will not police everything and everyone.
I will, however, think about some of the things you have said because despite being a critic you justify your arguments and express them in an intelligent way.
I’m not perfect and not opposed to any sort of criticism, as you have seen in the past.
Thank you.
No probs.
Forgot about the fan part. I admire the Js, both of them. I don’t admire their girls (what does not mean, that I hate them, mind you). I don’t insult them. But I don’t like the way Clif is handling his “job”. What does that make me? Am I being respectless?
You give yourself responsibility, you gotta take everything that comes with it. In Clif’s case, respect. Not only the respect from fans, but also for fans. It lessened a lot in last few weeks, but it hurt some people’s pride and he’s not apologizing. I can see that a lot of people are supporting him, but there is also a huge number that doesn’t, just because he’s being an insulting asshole to them. And that’s not insulting, that’s what he is by his own doing. People don’t hate on his personality or his life, but on the way he carries himself and the way he acts. He calls them haters, I mean WTF, I am a hater because I don’t like his shiteating “I’m better than thou”-attitude? Maybe that isn’t what he’s intending, but HE COMES OFF SO. Heck, it’s all about HOW people see your they way you’re doing it. It doesn’t make them stupid and his fans and your fans are totally harrassing the “haters” to be blind and ignorant and stupid, because you and he made them believe they are the better fans. I could ignore him, but you guys are working all of us deeper into this shit. You could ignore us, but that shows exactly the point I wanted to make with “the wave”, it’s not that extreme, but the progress is the same.
I wrote that before I saw that you replied, so, just so you know.
I just revised the about section and would like you to take a look at it.
About Clif: We do not have the same opinion on him and probably never will. But this blog also isn’t a “pro-Clif-campaign”. Clif is just someone that works on the same or similar things as I, who fights what has upset me in fandom for a long time.
About respect: I think if you like someone you are entitled to voice criticism or them or their loved ones. But you should not go about insulting and threatening them. If someone insults my friends or family, they insult me as well, and I don’t believe that person when they’re saying they like me, yet show no respect towards those I care about. That’s my whole point when I’m saying disrespectful haters are no true fans. There is a huge difference between constructive criticism or opinion and open hostility.
A fan that says “Danneel or Gen are horse-faced bitches” is no true fan of Jensen and Jared, by my definition. Someone who says they “don’t find them pretty and don’t like their acting skills” is.
Oh and btw: I also don’t really “like” Gen. Don’t like her, don’t hate her either, though. She’s never done anything to me. I’m not gonna watch any of her movies or tv shows and don’t have to be a fan of her. But I respect that Jared seems to love her and certainly would feel hurt if he read some of the extremely rude comments made about her.
EDIT: Oh and you asked how old I was. 29, so yeah, it’s been a while since I read “The Wave” but I still remember the key points.
Hehe, I’m 18, saw the movie in the theatre. Yeah, you are totally right about that part. Only, the difference is, you should not care who the true fans are. At least not here. You can talk about it as much as you want, privately. Respect is very difficult to describe. I wouldn’t care if people insult me, not in my face, but privately, so that only them and their friends know. That’s what they think of me, I don’t care, but if that person comes up to me and insults me right in public, then that’s another matter. I wouldn’t call everyone who insults the Js/D/G not being a true fan. It kinda depends on the situation. Being discreetly and all. But that’s my opinion.
So the best is just to leave the personal opinion out and stick with the hard facts. Noncommited. Noninsulting. Easy as that.
But thank you for reading and trying to understand what I wrote. I’m not the most eloquent english speaking person, but I try my best.
Your English seems very good. I’m not a native speaker myself, but I couldn’t point out any flaws in your writing
“So the best is just to leave the personal opinion out and stick with the hard facts. Noncommited. Noninsulting. Easy as that.”
You are right about this. And I will from now on. Taking back what I said or deleting it now does seem kind of hypocritical, though. I can make amendments (as intended with this second opinion based post) and clear up misunderstandings, but I won’t retract what I’ve said. But yes, from now on I will stick to hard facts in the articles.
EDIT: Oh and I like how the two of us, despite differences in opinion, can achieve common sollutions. It is very satisfying to see that there is some sort of grey area where we can find points we both more or less agree on.
I just want to say I don’t speak for fandom in any way. I speak for myself. I may not have been in this fandom as long as others, but that doesn’t mean I don’t care about it as much as those who have been around since day one. The Supernatural fandom is very diverse. And yes, we have our fair share of nuts. Very vocal nuts. But I have found that the majority of fans are very nice and helpful.
So all in all, this whole shit going on is only directed at sexyjensenlol, since he’s the only one who perhaps pretends to be real? And I say perhaps, as I’m sorry, but if you really are a “fan” of Jensen and “know” the person a little you can not possibly believe he’d use “sexyjensenlol” as a username… unless you are under a spell or totally stupid and in both cases, there is no reasoning possible.
I think I remember Clif tweeting that GennyCortese was a faker… I guess either his POV on policing is not the same as yours or he doesn’t know Gen enough to see the parody. In both cases, I can see a problem. Especially with this new video posting.
Were I sexyjensenlol, I’d be very honoured to be the centre of so much attention. And I’m still waiting for someone to prove to me that what started this whole thing really happened…
Everyones intentions may be good, but you guys have the worst way of making yourselves heard and considered.
It may appear illogical to point out the obvious. But since the human perception of obvious facts varies vastly, depending on a person’s linguistic skills, age, experience and social background, I do not see a flaw in the attempt to prevent people from believing something that isn’t true.
Furthermore, as stated various times and as can be concluded from the recent successful attempts, the main focus of fandompolice is to ensure that serious news sites and information resources provide reliability, that has been violated by Stephanie Ware, in their published information. I cannot logically find a flaw in that either.
There was a time when sexyjensenlol was talking to a girl who was 12. She was sharing personal info with him and sending him links to videos she made. That was very dangerous.
So how are we supposed to go about this? It’s against Twitter’s policy to impersonate someone. These people have been reported several times, yet Twitter has done nothing about it. Whether or not you think they’re harmless, they are violating Twitter’s rules.
Karmyn, that’s a rumour that’s been ridiculously exaggerated. Further, Twitter requires the person being impersonated, or someone *authorized* to act on their behalf (like an agent or management) to file a complaint. Fans can’t do it. Jared and Jensen or their team need to go through the process, instead of just saying ‘Clif is our man’ and tacitly endorsing all his bigoted and offensive comments.
It’s not a rumor. I saw the tweets myself. I haven’t checked his twitter in a bit, but I know at one time he was conversing with a girl who said she was 12 and did send him videos.
NGL, I LOL’d. Fandom has been policing itself for years before you came along and got all self-important and official.
We don’t need you. The idiots need you. Do what you want about the gullible morons who think the fake Twitter accounts are genuine, but don’t tar the entire fandom with your brush. You can go about your business and do whatever you want when it comes to policing the fakers and their herds of idiot followers, but don’t get in our faces about it. It’s incredibly obnoxious to assume that the majority of fandom – most of whom are intelligent and internet savvy- want you breathing over their shoulders in the pretense of keeping them safe.
We don’t care about parody Twitter accounts. We don’t care about Clif and his embarrassing ‘crusade’. We don’t need you telling us who the ‘true fans’ are (or the true Twitter accounts for that matter). We certainly don’t need you thinking that you speak for all of us. The majority of fandom wants nothing to do with you.
You are saying the idiots need me. That is an interesting statement that I would like do analyse in depth. It is clear that I have the same objective as Clif Kosterman in its core elements: minimizing impersonation and false information (such as provided by the person that calls herself Stephanie Ware) on social networks and information resources.
Clearly and logically, Jensen, Jared and Gen do share the same objective, otherwise they would not have published their videos and have Clif post on Twitter on their behalf.
So the logical conclusion to the known facts as listed above in accordance with your statement is that Jared, Jensen and Gen are idiots?
Fascinating.
Respect has to be earned. Clif has not only *not* earned my respect, he has earned the opposite. I despise him and his bigotry. If that makes me not a ‘true fan’ in your eyes, then I despise your bigotry too.
Let’s approach this with logic instead of emotion.
I looked up the definition of ‘fan’ on wikipedia. According to that definition being a fan, a ‘true fan’, includes adoration for the person one is a fan of. Adoration of course may include the willingsness to voice and accept criticism mutually, but it is also based on respect for a person’s wishes.
There are many expressions and deeds that are, my the majority of people, regarded as offensive and emotionally hurtful. By definition, true adoration should prevent one from using offensive and hurtful language or endorcing/tolerating it being used by others. It should furthermore make one sensitive and caring for the emotional and physical well-being of the object of adoration.
According to this widely accepted definition of adoration and being a fan, the logical conclusion is that anyone that violates these elements on a regular basis cannot refer to him- or herself as a true fan.
It is just a logical equation, based on definitions and reception of rudeness.
Proving your point with wikipedia…. Ace!
Once again, congratulations on telling people how to live their lives. We all obviously need to adhere to the same standards and do exactly as people on the internet tell us to. Thanks again fandom police! You guys save lives. In the words of young Dean Winchester, You’re a he-RO.
@Karmyn
PICS OR IT DIDN’T HAPPEN.
The fact that you feel the need to police those that you feel aren’t being respectful enough is quite possibly the most ridiculous thing I have ever read. Everyone has the right to their own opinion and it is not up to you or Clif OR ANYONE to decide what should or should not be said in fandom. You may not think that you are being elitist but this post absolutely reeks of elitism.
Fandom is a place where people can express their feelings about the show and the actors which often includes both negative and positive reactions. Did you also notice that when Clif and you guys showed up the fakers/parodies increased dramatically? I know for a fact that some of them were created in direct response to this blog so CONGRATULATIONS ON BEING PART OF THE “PROBLEM”.
I however, will continue to enjoy the parody twitters, thinking Clif is ridiculous, and having my own opinion on the show/actors whether it be positive or negative.
I am following all of the “fakers” on Twitter now that they’ve been pointed out to me. I wasn’t following ANY of them before. But I’m also geting a bigger laugh every time I read my twitter page, so I thank Clif and the police for pointing them out.
Jared and Jensen employ agents, PR reps, lawyers, managers, bodyguards – a whole host of professional people to handle the situations you are taking issue with.
Twitter has administrators who follow up on reports of fake accounts/accounts that don’t follow the TOS of Twitter. Yes, anyone can report an account, but it is then up to Twitter to deal with it; that is their ‘job.’
If Jensen and Jared is concerned about impostors, then they can have their management team get it taken care of. THAT IS WHY THEY EMPLOY THEM. They don’t need their ‘true’ fans deciding what is and isn’t acceptable.
Yes, they have said that Clif speaks for them. Great, let him continue to make a fool of himself (and them by proxy). Where exactly is fandompolice needed in this equation?
I have accounts on Twitter, LiveJournal, Facebook, etc. Should I violate the TOS of any of those sites, then I would expect to be contacted by officials from those sites to have the issue resolved. If you (or anyone else) felt that I was in violation of something on one of these sites, then by all means, report me. After that, it’s up to the administrators of said sites to resolve the situation.
I am an adult, participating in fandom as a hobby. I do not need or want a babysitter. I find that every existence of this blog offensive. You want to search the web and report impostors? Great! But anything further than that is way out of line.
Seriously, if you disagree with what Fandom Police and other fans are trying to do, why do you spend so much engery telling her she’s wrong? You could be doing something more productive with your time. She believes in her cause. Some agree with her. Some don’t. I don’t believe the ‘majority’ of fans don’t like it. Seems to me it’s just the same few people trying to cause problems.
Yes, most fans know who the fakers are. But there are fans out there who don’t want to believe these people are fakers or possibly dangerous. There are young fans out there. They don’t always think things through. There are adult fans who are the same way.
So you don’t like Clif. That’s your problem. He’s not hurting anybody. He’s just trying to do his job and interact with his fans.
Karmyn, you could be doing something ‘more productive’ with your time too, but you’re spending your energy telling the people *you* disagree with that you disagree with them. And that’s fine. Because you know what? People get to choose how they want to spend their time.
Anyway, Clif *is* hurting people. *That’s* my problem. That’s *why* I don’t like him. Bigotry is hurtful. People’s feelings matter.
What has Clif done to hurt people?
Oh, and I willingly admit I don’t have much of a life outside of the internet. I don’t have a family and I don’t have a job. I’m on permanant disability and don’t get out much. Supernatural is about all I have and I like to hope the fandom can stay safe.
Glad to see I’m not the only one stuck home on disability! Not that it’s a great thing to have..but I understand your situation.
GUYS, NONE OF THIS SHIT IS HELPING. The “fakers” GET OFF on you writing about them. It’s getting them attention, so they do what pisses you off MORE. It’s like a bully in high school: ignore it and they’ll go away. Show it bothers you and they go after you more.
If the people on Twitter are stupid enough to fall for it despite all the proof, they need help we can’t provide. And those who go to meet the fakers, deserve what they get for being so stupid, sry2say.
I’m sure Jensen and Jared are really proud of you you silly little fandom fuzz. Narc out those dastardly fakers. Toss them out on their ears!You say you aren’t an elitist fan, but the pen is mightier than the sword and your written words definitely point to you being an egotistical elitist little troublemaker.
Fandom doesn’t need a bunch of witch hunters. I am not even in the Supernatural fandom, but I do have a flister that has definitely been spooked by the idea of having a self-appointed fandom detective trying to “clean house” in the Supernatural fandom. She happens to be a very nice person, and due to your silly crusade, she’s paranoid about posting anything you may feel isn’t fitting. Thanks a heap, Tweet This sweetie.
Your friends paranoia is absolutely unnecessary. If she had read the About section of this blog and this article thoroughly she would know that as long as she doesn’t IMPERSONATE someone in more than a parodistic manner or committs SERIOUS SLANDER and LIBEL and/or THREATS towards anybody, then there is nothing I can or will do about her, even if she expresses an opinion I don’t agree with.
Oh how I wish people could actually read.
Oh, I think most of your detractors and followers of your blog can read just fine. I think maybe its your superior attitude that frightens or infuriates them. Maybe NOW you are satisfied just to hunt down and deal with impersonators, but who is to say that your focus might change in the future.My friend was nervous from reading between the lines, or perhaps the fine print, or maybe she didn’t want to take the time to read the About section or the article in its entirety. Do not assume that people can’t read just because they choose not to read everything you write. What on Earth do you expect to gain by “outing” these impersonators?
This is just hearsay, because I have not taken the time to search your blog’s archive, but I was told that one of your minions was instrumental in getting an impersonator evicted from her “crappy little apartment.” Geez how NOBLE! Now we probably have another homeless mentally ill person out on the street. Bravo!
I hate to point out the obvious, but what happened today with @jimbeaver? That is exactly why we “detractors” don’t want you doing what you’re doing.
You’re (we’re, actually, since the rest of us get dragged along with you) harassing innocent people now, to say nothing of all the attention being given to someone who is doing what she’s doing ~only for~ the attention.
Seriously, this has got to stop.
OMG, THIS!
When Jim tweeted that @jimbeaver was actually a real (other) person named Jim Beaver, I was SO embarrassed for all of us.
This this this. You’re making us all look like idiots, both by calling more attention to the actual fakers and by overreacting in response to them.
If something is written on the internet, it’s amazing how quickly the fans will attack them and police them and say, “No, this is not correct. Don’t write this. You’re off the messageboards” or whatever.
Are you seriously using *this* as your basis for policing fandom? All that quote does is show that fandom can police itself, and has been policing itself for some time, without some self-appointed warrior for truth coming in to speak on fandom’s behalf.
I fail to see what use you are here. I get that everyone needs a hobby but could you not find one that’s a little less self-important? I hear knitting’s fun.